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  • : However... there is a fundamental concern, should cloning become an alternately to, erm, traditional baby-manufacturing techniques. Evolution never stops. Every generation of humans is still playing the same old competitive natural selection game that we've always played.
    :
    : If we start short-circuiting natural selection by deciding which genes we want in the next generation (artificial selection, I believe it's called), I doubt we'll be able to maintain our competitive edge as a species.

    Haven't we already done this? Hasn't modern medicine allowed people to survive to reproductive age who wouldn't have otherwise? And who ultimately pass their weaker genes on?

    [size=5][italic][blue][RED]i[/RED]nfidel[/blue][/italic][/size]

  • : From that you can see what is being done (verb) to what (noun) and how (adjective).

    I freely admit that I did poorly in Grammar, but isn't "how" the adverb, not adjective? Of course, it depends on what you mean by "how", but I don't think it's an adjective any way you slice it.

    I (noun) drove (verb) the car (direct object) poorly (adverb).

    Damn, it's almost been a decade since I last took an English class.

    [size=5][italic][blue][RED]i[/RED]nfidel[/blue][/italic][/size]

  • Hi,

    : I freely admit that I did poorly in Grammar, but isn't "how" the
    : adverb, not adjective? Of course, it depends on what you mean
    : by "how", but I don't think it's an adjective any way you slice it.
    :
    : I (noun) drove (verb) the car (direct object) poorly (adverb).
    :
    : Damn, it's almost been a decade since I last took an English class.

    Hmmm...despite obtaining top grades in my English exams back in the days when I had classes in it, I honestly don't have a clue! I thought adjectives were words that described, so poor would certianly be an adjective... Like:-

    My English is poor. <== Poor is the adjective

    But whether becuase it's describing how something was done (e.g. poorly) makes it an adverb...I don't know. But I sense you might be right. <embarrassed look>

    Jonathan



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  • : Hmmm...despite obtaining top grades in my English exams back in the days when I had classes in it, I honestly don't have a clue! I thought adjectives were words that described, so poor would certianly be an adjective... Like:-
    :
    : My English is poor. <== Poor is the adjective
    :
    : But whether becuase it's describing how something was done (e.g. poorly) makes it an adverb...I don't know. But I sense you might be right. <embarrassed look>

    Adjectives describe nouns. I'm not sure about your sentence above. For some reason it looks different to me than saying "My poor English", in which case poor would be an adjective.

    I hate Grammar.

    [size=5][italic][blue][RED]i[/RED]nfidel[/blue][/italic][/size]

  • In the case of the sentence "My English is poor," the word "poor" is indeed an adjective. It is a special class of adjectives known as an "object adjective," in which the object of the verb serves as an adjective which "renames" the subject. Same applies to the word "fast" in the sentence "My car is fast," and to the word "drunk" in the sentence, "I am hopelessly, unforgivably and happily drunk."

    Take Care.
    Cody

  • : Haven't we already done this? Hasn't modern medicine allowed people to survive to reproductive age who wouldn't have otherwise? And who ultimately pass their weaker genes on?

    Oh, sure we have. However, science itself participates in the process of natural selection; as we've weakened the species, we've also developed the technology to maintain a genetically weaker species.

    And we could argue that the same would probably pass with cloning (indeed, this is one of the reasons why it doesn't worry me too much). The fundamental difference I see is this:

    With medical advances and such which allow genetically weaker specimens to survive, we're basically creating a larger gene pool with a wider standard deviation to determine "weakness." And as long as we can maintain the species (through technology or whatever), the natural selection process continues functioning... natural selection is just allowed a much broader playing field on which to operate.

    The hypothesis being that, should these weaker survivors actually threaten the species, they'd be the first to go in the next punctuated equilibrium anyway, regardless what medicine we have to help them.

    On the other hand, with cloning, we're actually narrowing the gene pool. Thus... even if we picked only the genetically "strongest" specimens to clone... natural selection isn't getting much to work with, and one good wallop could knock us all out.

    (Think about poodles again. Should humans disappear, poodles disappear. Zero survival chance.)

    Remember: genetic "fitness" can not be judged a priori. We are never evolving "toward" something; you only evolve [italic]from[/italic] something. Thus, what concerns me in cloning isn't whom we clone... it's that we're narrowing the standard deviation in the gene pool.

    Take Care.
    Cody

  • : (Think about poodles again. Should humans disappear, poodles disappear. Zero survival chance.)

    Of course, natural selection is also a great deal more devious than we give it credit for. So I perhaps shouldn't say that poodles have zero survival chance... but they will rapidly become unrecognizable as poodles.

    Take Care.
    Cody

  • you type sooo much. i skipped it for tonight and will probably read it partly next year somewhere.

    anyway, have a good start for the new year...


    : : (Think about poodles again. Should humans disappear, poodles disappear. Zero survival chance.)
    :
    : Of course, natural selection is also a great deal more devious than we give it credit for. So I perhaps shouldn't say that poodles have zero survival chance... but they will rapidly become unrecognizable as poodles.
    :
    : Take Care.
    : Cody
    :
    :

    [size=5][italic][blue]Dar[RED]Q[/RED][/blue][/italic][/size]

  • A perfect explanation. Thanks! You are brilliant.

    [size=5][italic][blue][RED]i[/RED]nfidel[/blue][/italic][/size]

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